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What happens when you go to bed living one life, and when you wake up, that life has totally changed?
In this episode of Fierce Calling, Doris welcomes Lisa Appelo, author, speaker, and Bible teacher, who is passionate about helping women find hope in grief, talk about loss, seek comfort in God, and find hope when life takes an unexpected turn.
Lisa suddenly became a widow in her forties and began walking through grief with her seven children. She shares how that experience led to her first book, Life Can Be Good Again, and her newest devotional journal, God of Comfort, which explores 50 aspects of God’s character for grieving hearts.
This conversation offers honest encouragement for anyone facing any type of loss in their lives, as well as practical guidance for those who want to support someone in grief.
Lisa explains:
*Why grief isn’t a tidy set of stage
*Why presence often matters more than perfect words
*How simple questions like “How can I pray for you today?” can make space for authentic and meaningful connection.
Together, Doris and Lisa point listeners back to the God who sees, sustains, understands, and remains with us. As Lisa says, “The way through grief is not a method. It’s not a prescription. It is a person”, and that person is the God of Comfort.
What Lisa shares will encourage, inspire, and challenge you, so listen in!
💡 Episode Highlights & Key Takeaways
04:37 Finding encouragement during grief
06:56 Meeting and Marrying High School Sweetheart
11:20 The importance of community support
15:28 Navigating the complexity of grief
16:47 Discussing the Comfort of God’s Character
20:18 Collaborating with the editor
26:20 Discussing expressions of grief and support
29:11 Discovering personal faith insights
30:48 Writing Christian books with purpose
35:46 Dealing with unexpected life changes
39:27 Wrapping up the podcast chat
🤝 Connect with Lisa!
You can connect with Lisa at lisaappelo.com and find all her books, social media links, blog, and free resources to encourage your heart. Lisa invites you to check out her newest book, God of Comfort: A Devotional Journal for the Grieving Heart and I definitely recommend grabbing extra copies to give as gifts!
Lisa Appelo is a speaker, author, and ministry leader passionate about helping women find hope in grief. She suddenly became a widow and solo mom of seven, navigating her grief and shepherding her children through theirs. She helps women navigate grief through her speaking ministry as well as in-person and online grief groups.
🙏 Remember, Friend, That Your Story Matters!
As always, remember—your journey, your fierce calling, and your honest story can comfort and encourage others. Where can you share your experiences this week?
Grace and peace,
Doris
Host, Fierce Calling Podcast
What Threatens to Steal Your Joy?
Check out Surrender the Joy Stealers: Rediscover the Jesus Joy in You 6-week Bible study rooted in John 15. You can find more info at https://dorisswift.com/book/
Let’s Stay Connected!
Find my free resources including Fear Fighting Bible Verses, Simple Tips for Sharing Your Faith, Step Out of Your Doubt and Into Your Calling ebook, and more on my dorisswift.com homepage!
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Thanks for Listening!
I hope this episode encouraged, inspired, and challenged you to cultivate community, live and walk in the value, purpose, and worth God gave you, and take action where your passion, compassion, and conviction intersect.
If you’re looking for a speaker for your next women’s conference, retreat, luncheon, or workshop, reach out and connect with me on my speaker page at https://www.womenspeakers.com/florida/edgewater/speaker/doris-swift
Let’s have a chat about your next event!
Stay tuned for more amazing content and remember to check the show notes for all the links mentioned.
Thank you for being a part of our community. We are grateful for your continued support and encourage you to embrace the unique gifts that make you magnificently you.
I hope you’ll join me next time when I talk with another guest who is taking action where her passion, compassion, and conviction intersect …
Until then friend, have a blessed week, and I’ll talk to you soon.
With love and joy,
Doris
Show Disclaimer
The views and opinions expressed by our guests are their own and do not necessarily reflect the official policy, position, or views of this podcast, its hosts, or its sponsors. The views expressed in this episode or any other episodes of this podcast are for informational purposes only. This content does not replace professional medical advice, mental health advice, diagnosis, or treatment.
Transcript
Doris Swift [00:00:00 – 00:01:35]
What if your hardest seasons, your deepest passions, and all the things you’ve walked through and are currently walking through were meant to become the very calling God has placed on your life? Welcome to the Fierce Calling Podcast. I’m your host, Dara Swift, and I invite guests who are taking action where their passion, compassion, and conviction intersect and share their stories Of faith, hard seasons, resilience, and their calling. So together we’ll discover how God uses every part of our stories, and how when we say yes to Him and use our gifts to impact the world, that God can do extraordinary things in the midst of our ordinary days. And sometimes hearing someone else’s yes to God is just what we need To find the courage to say yes to Him too. So my hope is that the stories you hear will encourage, inspire, and challenge you to step out and discover your own fierce calling, because your story may be the very place where God is preparing you to jump into the work He prepared in advance for you to do and to follow Jesus in deeper and more profound ways. So yes, this is Fierce Calling. And if you’re ready to discover where your passion, compassion, and conviction intersect and step out in faith to make a difference, you’re in the right place, friend. So listen in while I have a chat with today’s guest who has a message to share with you.
Doris Swift [00:01:36 – 00:02:27]
What is threatening to steal your joy? What is it that feels so heavy right now that you could barely stand? God has a plan, and His plan is to surrender it. Surrender it to Him. It might be a prodigal. It might be a relationship, a marriage, something with your job. So many things. We have so many amazing blessings, but there are so many things in our life that threaten to steal our joy. I’m Darris Swift, author of the award-winning 6-week Bible study, Surrender the Joy Stealers: Rediscover the Jesus Joy in You. And it helps women rediscover the overflowing, ever-present Jesus joy within that fills, empowers, and ripens the fruit that God produces in our lives.
Doris Swift [00:02:27 – 00:03:01]
Using personal and biblical stories, I share how you can identify your joy stealers, surrender them to God, reawaken the joy within, And share the joy with others. You can do it on your own or with a group. If you’re looking for a Bible study, check it out, friends. Surrender the Joy Stealers. Rediscover the Jesus joy in you. It’s time to take your joy back. Welcome back to the show. I am so happy to invite back my good friend Lisa Apolo.
Doris Swift [00:03:01 – 00:03:40]
She and I have known each other for quite some time, and It’s just encouraging to see her journey and how she’s ministered to so many hearts over these past several years. And I’m going to just tell you a little bit about her. She was on the show before, but it’s been a while, so I’m going to do a little refresh here. She’s a speaker, a writer, and a Bible teacher who is passionate about helping women find hope in grief. She helps women navigate losses through her speaking ministry, as well as in-person and online grief groups. She does a lot of events. Like that. And she also lives in Florida.
Doris Swift [00:03:40 – 00:03:49]
She’s very close to me, just a couple of hours away. So we’ll have to get together soon, as we always say. So welcome back to the show, Lisa. So great to have you back on.
Lisa Appelo [00:03:50 – 00:03:51]
Oh, thank you for having me, Doris.
Doris Swift [00:03:52 – 00:04:34]
This is very encouraging, and I can’t wait to talk about, first of all, your— the book that you had come out in ’22, which is right behind you, Life Can Be Good Again. And I also have that book, and I have a little story about that book, and I think I shared it with you, but also I posted it. In ’22, our house flooded when Hurricane Ian came through, and it was pretty devastating. It was really bad. And I just remember sorting through and picking up all the wet stuff all over the floor, all the clothes. Everything was just a mess and horrible. And, you know, I had sewage and all of that.
Anyway, TMI.
Doris Swift [00:04:37 – 00:05:20]
But the encouraging thing was, as I was going through different things, God would like— there would just be these encouraging things that I would find. Like one time I found this scripture verse that I had written on like an index card and had put it in a Bible or something. And anyway, it had floated somewhere where I was cleaning that day. And so I found that. But then I came across your book, Life Can Be Good Again. And we talk about the grief journey, and most often it’s when we lose someone we love very dearly. But grief comes in a lot of different forms. And that was kind of like— it felt like a grieving time for, for me and for our family and everything.
Lisa Appelo [00:05:20 – 00:05:21]
For sure.
Doris Swift [00:05:21 – 00:05:47]
And, you know, and God redeems it. But I po— I remember posting the picture of it. It was kind of a little wet and yucky, but it just— life can be good again. It was so encouraging for me to find that. So, I just wanted to share that real quick because of that book, and I loved it so much. But today, we are also— which we can talk a little bit more about that book too, but today we are talking about this book, which is also behind you. Oops, I put this in front of my face.
Lisa Appelo [00:05:47 – 00:05:48]
That’s okay.
Doris Swift [00:05:48 – 00:06:24]
God of Comfort: A Devotional Journal for the Grieving Heart, and it’s like 50 Devotions on the Character of God. So, Lysa, I’m excited. It’s a beautiful book, and I’ve read through it, and it’s just, it’s just so comforting and just so full of God’s Scripture and encouragement. And so, I would love if you would share a little about your story, and then, you know, how this all came about, writing this devotional, and how you’re taking action where your passion, compassion, and conviction intersect.
Lisa Appelo [00:06:25 – 00:06:54]
Yes. I remember that picture so well that you texted to me and then you posted. It was so poignant because it was like a message for you in the middle of your, your pain and this loss. And that book specifically, that first book, uh, Life Can Be Good Again, does address all different kinds of grief. It’s not just loss of a person, but there’s a lot of ways that we can, it can be a diagnosis or an estrangement. There’s just so many ways that we can, um, come to, to, to really be living in a life that we didn’t see coming.
Doris Swift [00:06:54 – 00:06:55]
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Lisa Appelo [00:06:56 – 00:07:34]
Um, so my story started, my, my chapter that I didn’t expect. You know, I was married to my high school sweetheart and we’d actually met in 7th grade, if you can believe it. He was just another boy in youth group across the room, but by high school we were really good friends. And then by our 11th grade year, we were dating. He was my first boyfriend. He was my only boyfriend. And I can remember him pulling up in his mom’s station wagon and looking out my bedroom window thinking, this is the first day of the rest of my life. And so, you know, we dated, we got married in college, we had kids, we started our careers, and life was not perfect.
Lisa Appelo [00:07:34 – 00:07:59]
I would not at all paint it as this idyllic, everything was rosy, because that’s not true life, is it? Um, we had struggles, we had things that we had to face. We had marriage issues we had to work through and children, you know, um, things that we had to work through. We had financial struggles as, as a new couple and just trying to get our feet on the ground as a, as a family. But by, um, this Father’s Day weekend, I was a mom of 7.
Doris Swift [00:08:00 – 00:08:00]
Mm-hmm.
Lisa Appelo [00:08:01 – 00:08:34]
And, um, you know, my youngest was 4, my oldest was 19. And we had a really— it was Father’s Day weekend. We were heading out for a big trip the next day. And so the kids kind of had gone upstairs after dinner to sleep. I had put the little ones to bed and I was turning in early. I said goodnight to my husband like I had 1,000 other nights. He was gonna stay up and do some work. And he said, I’ll be in there in a minute, you know? Well, the next thing I know was the next morning it was dark and I woke up enough to hear his funny breathing on the pillow next to mine.
Lisa Appelo [00:08:34 – 00:09:05]
It was not— I was not awake enough to understand what was going on, but within a few minutes I could sense that something was wrong. I flipped on the overhead light and I could see immediately that something was very wrong. And so, you know, Doris, I did all the things. We called 911, we started CPR. We— they were there within minutes. They took him by ambulance. And when I got to the hospital, they took me to the room that you never want to go in. And a very kind ER doctor said that they had worked on Dan and they had never been able to revive him.
Lisa Appelo [00:09:06 – 00:09:22]
And so that was, that was it. Like no signs, no symptoms. I went to bed in one life and woke up in another. And so there I was in this, um, walking through grief and walking my 7 children through grief. Hmm.
Doris Swift [00:09:22 – 00:10:07]
Yeah, I just, um, remember how you describe going to bed as a wife and waking up as a widow, and how that is so— it’s kind of such a powerful statement that really, like, I don’t know, it speaks to our hearts in a way that, you know, we just never know what’s going to happen. But when you, um, and, and having 7 children Wow. And you having to also walk them through it while you were going through it when you were at the hospital. I guess the older kids could stay home with the younger kids, right? And then were you— was anybody with you there at the hospital or it happened so fast? It was at a strange hour, right?
Lisa Appelo [00:10:08 – 00:10:26]
It happened so fast. It was dark when I, when I got to the hospital still. Yes, my oldest was at camp. He had no idea. He was at camp council at Ridgecrest. Had no idea this was going on at home. But my daughter, my next daughter and son, they were like, 17 and 16 were there and they had been sleeping on sleeping bags outside of our rooms. They had heard me cry out.
Lisa Appelo [00:10:27 – 00:10:49]
My 4-year-old had crawled in between the two of us. And so, you know, I was like, you know, take the two little ones upstairs. You just go into, you go into survival mode and management mode, you know, as a mom and, and trying to, to do the next thing. When, when I was at the— I did have the, um, sense to call somebody. I called a friend, woke them up, and they beat me to the hospital, believe it or not.
Doris Swift [00:10:50 – 00:10:50]
Wow.
Lisa Appelo [00:10:50 – 00:11:19]
The friend and her husband. And so they were there waiting for me when I got there. And I called my sister and, um, that was it. That was the only 2 people I called. Um, and by the time I got home, word had gotten out. And my— I got home, was able to tell my children kind of one by one or 2 at a time what was going on. And, um, my front door began to open. Friends, neighbors were getting the word and were coming just to be with us in our loss.
Doris Swift [00:11:20 – 00:12:04]
Wow, how powerful was that to have so much community? And how important it is to have people that you can call at any hour of the day or night who will be there, you know, for you. And so it’s so important to build community and have that even ahead of whenever something hard happens and be part of a community that will come to your home and be there to bring meals and comfort and all of that. And so, so going through this whole thing, and then of course your children going through it, and, you know, how, how old were you, uh, or actually Dan, when this happened? Probably is a more appropriate question. I was 45.
Lisa Appelo [00:12:04 – 00:12:28]
No, that’s okay. I was 45 and he was 46. Wow. And honestly didn’t know any other widow my age. Now I’ve come to know, especially through my ministry, widows much, much younger than me. Um, I met one a few weeks ago at our gathering who had never had— they were not even married long enough to have children. And so, would you, would you believe, Doris, that the average age of the widow in the United States is 59?
Doris Swift [00:12:28 – 00:12:29]
Wow.
Lisa Appelo [00:12:29 – 00:12:50]
That’s unbelievable, because we have this image, especially from the Bible, that it’s, you know, elderly, and they’ve lived a long time. And that’s just not the case. And so, you know, while my book, God of Comfort, is not just for widows, I tend to meet a lot of widows, because that is my— that’s part of my ministry, and I’m connected with them.
Doris Swift [00:12:52 – 00:13:14]
Yeah, so beautiful. And so when you— after you wrote Life Can Be Good Again, you were very involved in all that ministering to the women and doing these, um, what do you call them? They’re gatherings, uh, widow— that you gather with widows together. What is that called that you do?
Lisa Appelo [00:13:15 – 00:13:37]
It’s part of Never Alone. So Never Alone is a national organization, and it’s very— it’s really only been around for about 5 or 6 years, but such need for widows because so many churches don’t have the capability or haven’t started some kind of widows ministry. And part of the comfort that comes to us in grief is just knowing that you’re not alone.
Doris Swift [00:13:37 – 00:13:38]
Yeah.
Lisa Appelo [00:13:38 – 00:14:08]
And of course, God says that to us all through Scripture, from the beginning of you know, Genesis to Revelation, he says, you’re not alone. I am with you always to the end of the age. I will never leave you or forsake you. His very name of Christ when he comes to earth is Emmanuel, God with us. But it’s also helpful and comforting to have somebody else who gets it, you know, whether you have lost a child or parents, or you’re a widow or widower, to know somebody else who is going through it as well. Yeah.
Doris Swift [00:14:09 – 00:14:42]
And so, um, because I follow along, you know, when you post different things about the events, and I couldn’t think names. So thank you for sharing that, and we can definitely put anything in the show notes that you would want us to share with the listeners. And getting back to your beautiful book, how did this come about with you starting this devotional? And how did you— like, I know it’s through living through it, but how did this come about? Because there was, you know, a little time between your 2 books.
Lisa Appelo [00:14:45 – 00:15:27]
You know, culture would tell us that the, that grief is a tidy set of stages. And it’s just the paradigm that is handed out over and over and over through social media, through news organizations, and that there are these set stages that we all experience and we move through them. I think there’s been some wiggle room about whether we move through them sequentially. But there is this idea that there’s a set of stages that we just need to check them off. And most of us are grief naive unless you’ve had some kind of loss. If you’ve lost a person or a parent or a sibling or friend or spouse, child, stillbirth, I mean, you, until you experience grief, you think that that’s actually what happens.
Doris Swift [00:15:27 – 00:15:28]
Mm-hmm.
Lisa Appelo [00:15:28 – 00:16:07]
And as I move through grief, as I’ve met so many and walked so many through grief, I found over and over that it’s just not the case that grief is a messy mix of emotions all at once and hard questions. And we cycle through it over and over. We think that we’ve, we’ve worked through something only to like be pulled back in and, and pulled back down into it again and, and, and, um, have to work through it again. And so I realized that the way through grief is not a method. It’s not a prescription. It is a person. It is the God of all comfort. And for every pain that we experience in grief, which is far more than sadness, God meets us there.
Lisa Appelo [00:16:07 – 00:16:40]
And so this devotion, the way I designed it was to have, um, to talk about the character of God, that when we are lonely, we can look at God who sustains us, that when we are feel like nobody understands, that we can talk about the God who sees. That when we are missing our person, we feel like untethered, that we can talk about God, our dwelling place, who is our home, even though home doesn’t look the same anymore. And so it just walks the griever through the character of God. And of course, it’s not the full character of God. It’s 50 devotions.
Doris Swift [00:16:40 – 00:16:41]
Mm-hmm.
Lisa Appelo [00:16:41 – 00:16:47]
But it is, it is such a beautiful way to anchor ourselves into God who is with us in grief.
Doris Swift [00:16:47 – 00:18:31]
Yeah, that’s so beautiful and comforting for someone, especially how you explained all of that and laid that out. Because then, you know, as people are going through different grief stages, like you said, it’s not necessarily descriptive or descriptive for, you know, what everybody the same way. And, and like giving permission to not feel like I should be farther along, or, you know, or how people would even— not even meaning to, but I, but I know that sometimes people will feel like, okay, it’s been, you know, such and such a length of time, shouldn’t you be doing this now? Or don’t you want to get back doing this? Or, you know, those kind of things. So it’s very comforting to be reassured that the God of comfort brings the comfort, and that learning about his different, you know, his character is so amazing and comforting to everybody in all their seasons of life. And it’s important for us to know the character of God because sometimes people might have a different idea of who God really is. And it might stem from trauma from their past and things that have happened to them, or maybe something, you know, that happened with their earthly father, and, and just getting to know God and who he really is. And I love how you have these, um, you know, God of Mercy, God my Lord, God who Reigns, God of Truth, God my Provider, God who Wipes Every Tear. That is so precious.
Doris Swift [00:18:31 – 00:18:53]
God All-Knowing. Um, all of these different things that I know you also share in the book that it’s not meant to just go from front cover to back cover kind of thing. You can go to where, you know, whatever devotion you need on that particular day, right, Lisa?
Lisa Appelo [00:18:54 – 00:19:27]
Yes, you can look up, um, if you’re dealing with, for instance, say you’re dealing with a lot of lies, like, man, I just am, you know, my circumstances are telling me I’m never going to feel good again, and the enemy is bombarding me telling me that everything good is behind me, that this is always what it’s going to feel like. There’s other shoes gonna drop, all those lies that we hear in loss. Then go to God, you know, God of truth. There are, so yes, you do not have to do it in order. You can skip around. Um, and it’s interactive. I love that my publisher saw the vision for that. And there are journaling prompts that follow each devotion.
Doris Swift [00:19:28 – 00:19:28]
Yeah.
Lisa Appelo [00:19:28 – 00:19:50]
And then journaling space. So you can, you can write the date, you can write your prayer requests, you can write what God is teaching you. Um, Just your questions that you have, you know. And then what a powerful thing to be able to go back to this book and, you know, a year later or later and see the date and see where you were praying and see how God has met you.
Doris Swift [00:19:51 – 00:20:18]
Yeah, that is beautiful. I did, I did love that so much in the book that you have the, the prayers, kind of like guided prayer, you know, and then you have a question that they can answer in journal or even write their own prayer. Um, and so I’m just You can hear the pages turning. So this was actually published through Bethany House, and your editor was Jennifer Dukes Lee, right? Yes.
Lisa Appelo [00:20:18 – 00:21:03]
I just— I mean, what a dream team, right? So we share the same agent, literary agent. And then Jennifer, this is the second book that she acquired, and she has such a keen editing eye. She saw things that I didn’t and pointed out things. She’s also walked through grief. And so she had— she had recently walked her father home to heaven, you know, over the— over a long illness. And so she was able to make some, you know, ask some questions or add some tidbits that would— that were really helpful in shaping this book. So it’s not just for widows, and it’s not just for somebody who’s had a sudden loss. There are a lot of ways that we— somebody may have come to loss after years of caretaking for somebody.
Lisa Appelo [00:21:04 – 00:21:05]
Hmm. Yeah.
Doris Swift [00:21:05 – 00:21:26]
And And the grieving process is, you know, like, like we were saying, different for everyone. And I know that I’ve heard too where that even begins, like if you are caring— a caregiver for a loved one, it, it can begin, you know, as they’re still living because of what’s kind of coming and all.
Lisa Appelo [00:21:27 – 00:21:27]
Mm-hmm.
Doris Swift [00:21:27 – 00:22:01]
And of course, God has the final say, but we never know, and we can just, you know, trust him in what he has And, you know, I know that there’s a lot of different things that people might try to say that doesn’t really— I mean, good intentions, but doesn’t really feel very helpful or seem very helpful at the time. What kind of things that people did say to you were comforting for you? And what are some of the things that you say to other people in this? When you’re ministering to them?
Lisa Appelo [00:22:02 – 00:22:35]
Yeah, that’s a great question. I wrote a poem about it. So there are a few poems sprinkled throughout the book, and the poem is called I Bit My Tongue at Her Words. And then it talks about how I’ve put my own foot in my mouth, you know, before I knew better. We all mean well, and I know it comes from a place of typically meaning well. And so to extend that grace that we need ourselves, I think the things that we can say that are helpful are, um, number one, we don’t have to say anything. I think that’s the biggest thing is that we don’t have to show it. Like, our words are not gonna fix it.
Lisa Appelo [00:22:35 – 00:22:51]
And we so want to, to take care of somebody’s pain and alleviate their pain, and that’s well-meaning, but nothing we can say is going to take the sting of loss away. And so sometimes we may just show up and we may just sit with them and listen.
Doris Swift [00:22:51 – 00:22:52]
Mm-hmm.
Lisa Appelo [00:22:52 – 00:23:18]
And our showing up says everything that needs to be said. I think one of the things that we can say that’s super helpful is, how can I pray for you? Um, how are you doing today is too broad. The person who’s walking through loss doesn’t really know how to answer that. They’re so overwhelmed. And so to say, how can I pray for you today? It allows that person to pull up one of their prayer needs and answer authentically kind of how they’re doing.
Doris Swift [00:23:18 – 00:23:18]
Mm-hmm.
Lisa Appelo [00:23:19 – 00:23:22]
And then you get to actually proactively say, I’ve got that covered.
Doris Swift [00:23:23 – 00:23:23]
Yeah.
Lisa Appelo [00:23:23 – 00:23:49]
Like, I will pray for your sleep, or I will pray for your child, or I will pray for that appointment you have, or whatever it is that person asks you to pray for. I think to say, um, I’m here to help. I’m here to help. And just, again, you don’t have to actually say that with words. You can actually do that. And that might be, hey, can I, you know, I’ve got dinner for you. Is Tuesday or Thursday a better night? Not like, hey, would you like some dinner? Because yeah, we know we’re, We are bad at receiving.
Doris Swift [00:23:50 – 00:23:50]
Yes.
Lisa Appelo [00:23:50 – 00:24:06]
You know, we’re bad receivers. But, but to say, I’ve got this and I’m gonna bring it, which day is easier, just makes, just makes it so simple. Um, and then to say, like we said before, you’re not alone, which is, and it may come with, you know, we’re in the South here, Doris, right?
Doris Swift [00:24:06 – 00:24:06]
Right.
Lisa Appelo [00:24:06 – 00:24:33]
So that comes with a big hug and it comes with shared tears as we weep with those who weep. But maybe where you’re from, it comes with a, you know, just, Just saying, like, you’re not alone. I’m with you in this. And I will, I will remember this day. And I want to hear your heart, or texting them, or sending a card or remembering the milestone days. Those are easy ways to walk with somebody in grief.
Doris Swift [00:24:34 – 00:25:04]
Yeah, that’s beautiful. Beautiful reminders of remembering them on milestone days, and things that are especially hard. And just because it’s been more than a year or more than 2 years, you know, it’s, it’s, it’s always encouraging to the person to receive, to know that somebody is thinking of them and remembering their loved one, really. I had Sherry Fletcher, um, on the show, and she was talking about that too.
Lisa Appelo [00:25:04 – 00:25:04]
Yes.
Doris Swift [00:25:04 – 00:25:38]
And how, you know, you don’t wanna not talk about your loved one. You know, you wanna talk about your loved one. And I think it’s awkward for people sometimes, and people try to avoid even a conversation because they’re afraid to say something wrong or whatever. But I love your advice. It’s very practical, and it is good to give people like an option instead of an overwhelming question. And so, Just the ministry of presence too. Like you said, just being there. ‘Cause sometimes we don’t know.
Lisa Appelo [00:25:38 – 00:26:01]
And you know, here’s the things. Oh yeah. Here’s the thing. We’re, if you say something 10 years in, you’re not reminding them. It’s not like they were having a great day and then you said, hey, I’m remembering that this is a hard day for you. Or I’m remembering, you know, your son today. Or I’m remembering, um, that time that I was with them and I just, I just wanna share that story with you. You’re not reminding them.
Lisa Appelo [00:26:01 – 00:26:20]
It is. there all the time. And they will so appreciate that their person is not forgotten, that you do remember. It is so meaningful. So it can feel awkward. I get that. But remembering and entering into it is just— it’s such a way to love somebody for the long term in grief. Yeah.
Doris Swift [00:26:20 – 00:27:34]
And thank you too, for the conversations around it, because it, it will help people to know what to do or what to say or what, you know, maybe what not to say, but more so to feel like if they’re feeling like a prompt to say something, that it’s okay to say something that is, you know, uh, remembering the— your loved one, you know. So that, that is encouraging. I love hearing that because sometimes we could tend to think, oh, they might be having a good day, I don’t want to like ruin it, or, you know, something like that. It’s kind of normal and natural for us to feel that way. But I just, you know, I just remember, you know, when we were talking about different types of grief and things, you know, going through the flood, what— and then it’s like 2 years later, the house flooded again. It wasn’t as bad as the first one. And it’s not to compare like a flood to losing a spouse or a child, you know, but just when we’re talking about different types of grief and loss and things like that. Um, you know, just to see community coming around and, and kind of like a bond of unity.
Doris Swift [00:27:35 – 00:28:13]
And it’s, it’s a perfect time to, like, when we are going through a lot, where people say, wow, but I don’t understand how you have this peace, and kind of an open door to share the love of, of Christ, you know, with other people. So, um, You’ve had a lot of opportunity to share about Jesus and, you know, in the comfort of God. Was there any particular devotion in the book that was more— I, I hate to say more near and dear to your heart than another, or harder than another to write? Any that come to mind?
Lisa Appelo [00:28:15 – 00:29:11]
Everybody’s gonna have one that maybe speaks to them particularly, but for me, I loved writing the one that It is on God Who Sees, and it starts, not everybody gets a casserole in grief, something to that effect. Not all grievers get a casserole. Because I know from walking with so many that sometimes, even if somebody knows about your loss, they may not know all the details. They may not understand that it was much more complicated than people see, or that they were more than just a friend. Like, this friend was like a sister, like a— like, family to you. And so it’s more than just friend grief, or they might not understand that this loss created a series of cascading losses. And, um, and so to, to write that devotion that God— and that if nobody in your circle understands, and if you can’t even share because it’s not your story to share, Mm-hmm. God sees and he understands.
Lisa Appelo [00:29:11 – 00:30:02]
I loved pulling that out of scripture and just Um, applying that in our life. And then I think personally for me, one that was new to me, you know, every time we get in the word, we see things that are, that hit us new. If even if we read it so many times, I had read a scripture that said it’s in Psalm, Psalm, um, 34. Is that right? No, no, no. It’s in Psalm 56, right after the verse that says God bottles all of our tears, you know, that he keeps track of all of our sorrows. The next verse says that God is for us. And on this particular day, I was not writing for the devotionals, my own personal Bible time. I could not move off that scripture because I think for so long, Doris, I think being part of the going to church and, you know, seeing things on my algorithm and the coffee mugs, I thought God is for you was like a platitude that we just put on a t-shirt.
Doris Swift [00:30:03 – 00:30:03]
Hmm.
Lisa Appelo [00:30:03 – 00:30:07]
And to see it in scripture, God is for you.
Doris Swift [00:30:07 – 00:30:08]
Yeah.
Lisa Appelo [00:30:08 – 00:30:47]
I just could not, I couldn’t shake it that God doesn’t just like see us, that God is not just with us, but God is for us. Just the fact that he would champion us, that he would love us so much that he would enter in and be like, I am with you. Like, I am, I am, I am cheering you and championing you on in this hard place. And this flood door, it’s the second time and you’re weary and thinking, really, really? Did I not learn all the lessons that I could in the first time? Mm-hmm. To be reminded that this is not punishment, that God is for you. That was just a place for me personally that I needed. So I love that devotion.
Doris Swift [00:30:48 – 00:31:58]
That’s great. And I know that it’s going to encourage someone listening right now that needed to hear that. And, you know, when you write a book, when you’re a Christian author and you’re writing a book and you’re doing it, you know, obviously through a biblical lens, a biblical perspective, and you’re in the Word, it really helps you get into the Word. And then the fruit of it comes out, you know, in what you are blessed to be able to write that can minister to other people. Um, people will see this that might— you know, that I know there will be people that see this book, it’s so lovely and beautiful and it just catches your attention the way it looks and all of that. But God of Comfort, who would not want to pick that up? And I’m just thinking about those who are not yet believers believers who don’t really know God or even wonder if there is a God, and then pick this up and start reading through it and really start to see. Because, you know, the, the word says that when we draw near to God, he draws near to us. And when people are seeking, they will find him, you know.
Doris Swift [00:31:58 – 00:32:16]
And so I think that’s wonderful, and it’s just going to be so comforting to people who maybe give this as a gift. Maybe that’s something that you, you don’t know what to say, but you can hand them this book. You know, it’s like, let me get this.
Lisa Appelo [00:32:16 – 00:32:44]
And I’ll tell you, the day Dan died, I said to my friends who were coming to the— coming to my house, I’m gonna— in like a, like a fog, I said, I’m gonna need books. I’m gonna come because I did not know what grief would look like. I did not know how to walk my kids through. I did not know what to expect. And so my friends did that. They got online, they Googled, they looked to see what’s out there. And, um, man, that was a gift. So there’s actually a gift page in this book.
Lisa Appelo [00:32:44 – 00:32:51]
There’s a to-from page. So if you wanted to give this to somebody, yeah, it would be a nice— yeah, nice way to see them.
Doris Swift [00:32:51 – 00:33:12]
What a blessing. What a blessing. And it’s not overwhelming. Like, I know that when we have things in our life and the seasons in our life that are hard and we can’t, um, you know, really see one foot in front of us kind of thing. Um, like just losing my mom in January, it was—
Lisa Appelo [00:33:12 – 00:33:12]
Hmm.
Doris Swift [00:33:13 – 00:34:10]
It was hard. Like, we— she’d been sick for a while with different things, but she fell twice, you know, between Christmas and New Year and— or right before Christmas. And, and so it was like, you know, you get into the seasons where you feel too overwhelmed even to read or do anything like that. But because this is so, um, one thing comforting— I’m gonna keep saying that word because it’s so true— and it’s God’s comfort that you’re sharing, um, it’s not overwhelming. And it can just be, you know, it’s just like, okay, here’s, here’s God my Father. You know, it’s page 75 and page 76, and then page 77 is a prayer to God my Father and a journaling prompt. And you can do that as you do it, or you can go back and do it later, or whatever. But I love what you had mentioned about, um, putting the date there.
Lisa Appelo [00:34:10 – 00:34:11]
Mm-hmm.
Doris Swift [00:34:11 – 00:34:52]
So you can go back and really see, because Because sometimes we forget things that God has done in our life, and you go back and see something you wrote, you know, you wrote way back, and you just see, wow, how God brought me through. And it’s just, you know, it keeps us going and encouraging others about how the faithfulness of God and what he’s done in our stories too. So this has just been so amazing. And if you have any last Maybe words you might want to share with someone listening today before we let them know how they can connect with you and find your books?
Lisa Appelo [00:34:54 – 00:35:46]
I— yes, I, you know, so often in grief and loss, we get hyperfocused on our circumstance. And part of that is because we have so much grief work to do, hard work to do, right? So that’s, that’s normal. But we can hyperfocus there, and— or we can look back at the life we wanted. Or we can look around at everybody else, and it seems like they’re living their best life while we’re walking through this deep sadness. But the way through grief is to fix our eyes on God of comfort. And so that was really the goal of this book, to have a daily time, or maybe a few times a week, where you can open this book, and it’s rooted in Scripture, and then to fix your eyes on God who is with you in your circumstance. Because He is with you, He loves you with an everlasting love, and He will walk you So beautiful.
Doris Swift [00:35:46 – 00:36:55]
And it just kind of— when you were talking about that, it reminded me years ago, because I was a banker for many years, and I remember when one of our customers had passed away and his wife came in, and they were young, they were very young. And she just— I just remember her saying, you know, there isn’t any, like, instruction book for this, like, how to do this. You know what to do, and there’s different things that you know you don’t really think of. Like wow, this particular light bill was in my husband’s name. How do I transfer it to mine? You know different things like that. But then you have people that can come around and help you with those kind of things. But it just struck me though about how she said that there’s no like instruction book for dealing with this. But when you just said fix your eyes on you know God, focus on him, and when you work through this and walk through this devotional journal— and it is a journal, which is amazing— and some people might not like journaling or might feel like journaling is overwhelming, but it doesn’t have to be long.
Doris Swift [00:36:56 – 00:37:03]
And it might be something that you just now in this season find new to you.
Lisa Appelo [00:37:04 – 00:37:14]
You know, I was not a journaler before at all, um, but I became one because there’s so much in your— in our heart and mind, and it just helped me to kind of unburden everything.
Doris Swift [00:37:14 – 00:38:10]
Yeah, yeah, so beautiful. And a place to keep that, you know, in this like beautiful book and keep it right next to your word of God and just read that whenever it’s good for you. It’s not always going to be in the morning, it could be any time of the day, but it is precious to start your day with your focus on God, you know, when you first get up. Mornings can be hard, but, you know, then you’ve got your, your devotional that people can grab. And yeah, and I love giving it as gifts. If you have a grief ministry at your church, like Grief Share or something like that, it would be great for them to have copies as well. So I’m gonna definitely share this with the person who leads our grief share, because I think it’ll be amazing, and I know they’ll like it a lot, love it. So Lisa, this— yeah, thanks again for all of the things that you shared.
Doris Swift [00:38:10 – 00:38:21]
It’s been very encouraging and a blessing, and I would love if you would share how the listener can connect with you, how they can find your books, and any other resources that you have to offer too.
Lisa Appelo [00:38:22 – 00:38:42]
First, so they can find me, they can find all the information about the book at God of www.godofcomfortbook.com. Um, and then I’m at Lisa Apolo. It’s 2 Ps, 1 L. I’m there on Instagram and Facebook and my website. Um, and I do have a free resource. They’ll find it on my website if they go to lisaapolo.com.
Doris Swift [00:38:44 – 00:38:44]
Mm-hmm.
Lisa Appelo [00:38:44 – 00:38:48]
It’s called 7 Days of Hope for Your Shattered Heart.
Doris Swift [00:38:48 – 00:38:48]
Mm-hmm.
Lisa Appelo [00:38:49 – 00:39:04]
And it’s been my most popular resource. So I don’t know, thousands of downloads at this point. And it’s— we know that grief is not solved in 7 days. But it’s a great way to, to begin. It gives some really proactive steps that you can do in grief.
Doris Swift [00:39:05 – 00:39:20]
Thank you for that. And I’ll have that all in the show notes so people can reach out and find you and follow you, you know, on social media, whatever they, you know, whatever one they’re on. And, and so thank you so much again for being back on the show. And I’d love to have you back again.
Lisa Appelo [00:39:21 – 00:39:27]
Thank you, Doris. Oh, it’s good. I feel like we’re just right down the road, but we’re talking by computer.
Doris Swift [00:39:27 – 00:40:06]
So yeah, I know. Yeah, well, thank you so much for being on. And yeah, technology is amazing. It’s, it’s great to be able to connect and, you know, just use it for the glory of God, because there’s a lot of ways that technology is not used for the glory of God. So we just, you know, want to do that and get the word out in this beautiful message. and this beautiful book, and your other book as well is just amazing. And so, friends, thank you so much for joining us today on the Fierce Calling Podcast, and I hope you’ll join me next time when I talk with another guest who’s taking action where their passion, compassion, and conviction intersect. Until then, friends, have a blessed week, and I’ll talk to you soon.
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